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Thursday, 05 June 2008

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Comments

RMacleod

This is definitely melt down stuff, I watch with interest.

MacPayne

I understand the diplomats have been released, but this is evidence the Zanu-PF has gone into "desperation mode". The moderates within Zanu-PF better get control before the entire country reverts to savagery. Obviously, there's no dignity or intelligence or sanity or civilized authority running their show right now. At least, someone was trying to bring some accountability, while the SADC still sits picking their noses. Shame on them!

Michael

Ahhhh, now the Americans speak ...... they can't be bothered raising their voices until one or two of their own come into the firing line, and that's typical US government behaviour.

Maybe someone ought to remind these people that their institution is partly at fault, for giving Mugabe the chance to install himself in the first 'free and fair' (LOL) elections in the first place ..... and then wonder why they seem to have forgotten this one simple fact.

It may not be the ideal way of doing things, but maybe, just maybe, reminding them of these facts would give the UK and US governments the kick up the jaxi they need to get off their high horses and help the people whose suppression and misery they bear a certain measure of responsibility for.

MacPayne

Well, Michael, if the West were to intervene, there'd go Mbeki's "quiet diplomacy"... he'd be jumping around like Zuma, screaming to the high heavens, and declaring a crisis. And, we'd finally hear some condemnation from the SADC... unfortunately, none of it would be directed at Mugabe and Zanu-PF. Even the UN would finally get up and do something... like overwhelmingly denounce those trying to help the people of Zim.

(I did read somewhere today that the Kenyan Prime Minister has labeled Mugabe a dictator.)

Michael

Oh, I know there would be condemnation for the actions if it were to happen ..... but then again, there is more at stake in Zim than a little bit of hot air and reputations.

And if it's going to take a couple of bruised egos in SA and the west to put right what was set in motion in the 70's and remove ZANU-PF from their stolen power, then so be it.

Let Mbeki mouth off, let the UN condemn the actions of a few countries. History would show in the end that it was the right thing to do, and that the rantings of a few fools who didn't have enough faith in their own convictions to step in and stop the torture, murder, and pillage of Zimbabwe and its people would show their fearfully small minded and lethargic mindset.

What I'm saying here isn't a suggestion of a return to UK/US rule (before the usual 'you're a colonialist sympathiser' accusations roll in), what I am suggesting is that the UK and the US step in to correct their mistake and negligence in putting these tin pot Hitlers in power in the first place ..... and I think it should be done unconditionally as a free service, with complete power being handed over as soon as the task is complete.

DC

Michael, there is no such thing as a 'free service'. The US and UK would want something from any new government as a return for the favour. They didn't invade Iraq because they hated Saddam. They invaded because they hated Saddam having Iraq's oil. (That, and the now discredited notion of a quick war to give Bush a boost as a 'war president' etc).

Okay, assuming that the US or UK or both wanted to invade for the good of Zimbabweans how could they do it. Firstly a round of resolutions at the UN - which would be blocked for months or years by China, Russia and definately South Africa.

If they went unilaterally to invade, logistically Zim would be extremely difficult to invade. Zim is landlocked, which means they have to fly over other SADC countries (pro-Mugabe) to drop troops/bombs whatever. That would never be allowed. Secondly and for the same reason, no US or UK troops would be able to set up bases in neighbouring countries without being ostracised by other Afican countries for being anti-Mugabe or pro-Imperialist.

Finally, and I think this is important to remember, SADC and the AU still believe that Mugabe is a constitutionally elected legitimate leader of Zimbabwe. If the chips come down to it I believe they would fight for Mugabe. We could end up starting a world war, with the West on one side supporting Zimbabweans, and Africa, Russia and China on the other supporting Mugabe and Co.

Fanciful? Maybe - but all in all it means that there will never be an invasion. Its up to Zimbabweans now to fight with sticks, stones, bottles, car-bombs, anything, on the streets without help from anyone but each other.

Michael

Fanciful? Unfortunately not, because thats near exact to what it would in all likelihood lead to, and Mugabe knows it ..... he has Mbeki eating out of his hand and can thumb his nose at the rest of the world because they can't touch him.

And yes, I know that they wouldn't provide it as a free service ..... no-one gets anything for nothing, even when the providers would be the ones who caused the problem in the first place.

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